Community Theater Green Room Discussion Board: communication from tech booth to back stage

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MartyW
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Posted: 12/08/09 at 1:06pm

Many years ago, and many theaters, I wired up a system using telephone operator headsets and a transformer.... It worked well and much along the lines of a poor man's clear-com wired system. We installed it at a SR wing, SL Wing, the lobby and both lights and sound positions in the booth. The liability was that it was not Radio Wire Integrated (RWI). So we were dependent on being within a couple of feet of those locations (or as far as the headset would reach. Today (at a different theater, and at most of the others I work at) we use a radio system, much like your radio shack (if not the same at some venues) Though far from the most reliable, they are the most flexible and low cost/low tech option...

Marty W

"Till next we trod the boards.."

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Gaafa
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Posted: 12/08/09 at 7:32pm

Helping out with a number of comeatres over the years, I'm still surprised at the number of venues that have no communication systems at all. They just bumble along, reling on each section to do thier own thing & hope for the best to happen.

They invarably get it right on the last night or in some cases after the first week or so, with some form of hit or miss signaling method.

Which with a lot of groups this sort of works, as they have less than a few cues to contend with, beyond lights up & down. Leaving the lighting/audio to do the show control from the bio box & the SM to look after the props & whatever?

I prefer the SM to remain on the 'devils side' {Prompt side [S/L]} & not in the bio box & to have full control of the show 'bible'. (I realise that in the US an ASM normally calls the show cues, but as I'm a 'POHMy Bathplug', I opt for the British system, which is done by the SM.)

However this may help with setting up various 'TALKBACK' systems & even interfacing radio with wire/wire to systems;-

http://www.telexradiocom.com/binary/Handbook%20of%20Intercom%20Systems%20Engineering.pdf

Beltpack.com

In most proeatre venues here we use the Jands belt pack head sets, which are robust as a wire/wire talkback. I don't know any that have gone in for radio belt packs, except TV stations. None of them use the radio shack toy belt pack type.

But there is still a lot to be said for the old Trafffic Light Cue systems, which are cheap work well & easy enough to cobble together.

Joe
Western Gondawandaland
turn right @ Perth.
Hear the light & see the sound.
Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"}
May you always play
to a full house}

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Spectrum
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Joined: 4/16/04
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Posts: 176

Posted: 12/09/09 at 12:14am

Something I did for a small (and penniless) community theatre many years ago was build an intercom system with wired headsets at key locations. Since most of the communication issues had to do with when to START, or indicate something needed to happen NOW, I freed up people backstage and in the tech booth (and even in the box office) from wearing the headsets most of the time by incorporating a blue indicator light into the base of each unit with a set of pushbutton triggered 'flashing signals' so we could communicate silently among our crews. We knew WHAT to do, just not WHEN to do it. I wonder if I should resurrect that design and offer it to penny pinching community theatres everywhere. Hmmm...

Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional.

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Kathy S
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Posted: 12/09/09 at 11:58pm

Yeah, that might be a good idea... sometimes, though you REALLY need to talk to some key person in the backstage area, so I'd keep the headset option in it. I like the idea of a light that tells them when to go.

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Gaafa
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Posted: 12/10/09 at 2:16am

Spectrums design sounds interesting, maybe this could be incorporated in an FM powerline intercom with mic/can modifications.

http://www.cosycommunications.com/592CATALOGUE.htm

Joe
Western Gondawandaland
turn right @ Perth.
Hear the light & see the sound.
Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"}
May you always play
to a full house}

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Spectrum
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Joined: 4/16/04
Location: United States
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Posts: 176

Posted: 12/10/09 at 5:56am

Good one, Gaafa. I have actually designed and built a 'carrier current' communication system, and yes, the flashing lights would be very easy to incorporate into a system like that. There could be problems using carrier current technology with the multiple power circuits in a theatre environ, but it's worth looking into it. As my original design included (and Kathy S emphasized), it MUST include voice capability as well, because sometimes verbal communication is R E A L L Y important. This may be the first discussion board designed (of, by, and for theatre people) communication system in the world. ...Just remember, guys, I started it! HA! ;-)

Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional.

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Gaafa
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Location: Australia
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Posted: 12/10/09 at 7:37pm

Good idea!

Thinking about this I have utalised a set of those cheap Infrared Baby montors, that use the powerline as an FM carrier, to great effect backstage. While this allows the bio box & SM to see in the dark, during blackouts. It would not be that much of a stretch, to incorporate a headset [mic/cans] using the other type baby monitor systems available.

Most are compact units & can be used as belt packs, hitching in call & flashing light switches, as suggested.

Not only but also the wireless can also be used for as show monitor relays to the dressing rooms, as they are easily concealed on the set.

As far as the multi power circuit problem, we have an installing convention here. in acordance with SAA 3000 Wiring regulations, that the 3 Phase cabling installation, must be colour phase indicated at the General Purpose Outlet [GPO] & follow the code of Red, White & Blue. Undoubtably most sparkies use Red Phase for the primary utility power circuit, so it just a matter of checking the phase colour or following the electrical schemetic legend.

Actualy Spectrum it would great to collectivly come up with something here on this forum, that can be utalised in most ameatre venues - Yes you can have all the kudos mate!

Joe
Western Gondawandaland
turn right @ Perth.
Hear the light & see the sound.
Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"}
May you always play
to a full house}

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TimmyP1955
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Joined: 12/30/09
Location: United States
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Posts: 37

Posted: 1/02/10 at 1:19pm

ClearCom has been the standard for years. However we went with Production Intercom on the recommendation of a large local production company - "they are less expensive and more reliable". http://www.beltpack.com/

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Lights and Sound
Community Theater Green Room Discussion Board :Producing Theater :Lights and Sound

Topic: communication from tech booth to back stage( Topic Closed)
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Author	Message
MartyW Celebrity Joined: 2/02/04 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 555	Posted: 12/08/09 at 1:06pm
	Many years ago, and many theaters, I wired up a system using telephone operator headsets and a transformer.... It worked well and much along the lines of a poor man's clear-com wired system. We installed it at a SR wing, SL Wing, the lobby and both lights and sound positions in the booth. The liability was that it was not Radio Wire Integrated (RWI). So we were dependent on being within a couple of feet of those locations (or as far as the headset would reach. Today (at a different theater, and at most of the others I work at) we use a radio system, much like your radio shack (if not the same at some venues) Though far from the most reliable, they are the most flexible and low cost/low tech option...
	Marty W "Till next we trod the boards.."
	IP Logged

Gaafa Celebrity Joined: 3/21/04 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1181	Posted: 12/08/09 at 7:32pm
	Helping out with a number of comeatres over the years, I'm still surprised at the number of venues that have no communication systems at all. They just bumble along, reling on each section to do thier own thing & hope for the best to happen. They invarably get it right on the last night or in some cases after the first week or so, with some form of hit or miss signaling method. Which with a lot of groups this sort of works, as they have less than a few cues to contend with, beyond lights up & down. Leaving the lighting/audio to do the show control from the bio box & the SM to look after the props & whatever? I prefer the SM to remain on the 'devils side' {Prompt side [S/L]} & not in the bio box & to have full control of the show 'bible'. (I realise that in the US an ASM normally calls the show cues, but as I'm a 'POHMy Bathplug', I opt for the British system, which is done by the SM.) However this may help with setting up various 'TALKBACK' systems & even interfacing radio with wire/wire to systems;- http://www.telexradiocom.com/binary/Handbook%20of%20Intercom%20Systems%20Engineering.pdf Beltpack.com In most proeatre venues here we use the Jands belt pack head sets, which are robust as a wire/wire talkback. I don't know any that have gone in for radio belt packs, except TV stations. None of them use the radio shack toy belt pack type. But there is still a lot to be said for the old Trafffic Light Cue systems, which are cheap work well & easy enough to cobble together.
	Joe Western Gondawandaland turn right @ Perth. Hear the light & see the sound. Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"} May you always play to a full house}
	IP Logged

Spectrum Celebrity Joined: 4/16/04 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 176	Posted: 12/09/09 at 12:14am
	Something I did for a small (and penniless) community theatre many years ago was build an intercom system with wired headsets at key locations. Since most of the communication issues had to do with when to START, or indicate something needed to happen NOW, I freed up people backstage and in the tech booth (and even in the box office) from wearing the headsets most of the time by incorporating a blue indicator light into the base of each unit with a set of pushbutton triggered 'flashing signals' so we could communicate silently among our crews. We knew WHAT to do, just not WHEN to do it. I wonder if I should resurrect that design and offer it to penny pinching community theatres everywhere. Hmmm...
	Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional.
	IP Logged

Kathy S Celebrity Joined: 8/21/04 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 303	Posted: 12/09/09 at 11:58pm
	Yeah, that might be a good idea... sometimes, though you REALLY need to talk to some key person in the backstage area, so I'd keep the headset option in it. I like the idea of a light that tells them when to go.
	IP Logged

Gaafa Celebrity Joined: 3/21/04 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1181	Posted: 12/10/09 at 2:16am
	Spectrums design sounds interesting, maybe this could be incorporated in an FM powerline intercom with mic/can modifications. http://www.cosycommunications.com/592CATALOGUE.htm
	Joe Western Gondawandaland turn right @ Perth. Hear the light & see the sound. Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"} May you always play to a full house}
	IP Logged

Spectrum Celebrity Joined: 4/16/04 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 176	Posted: 12/10/09 at 5:56am
	Good one, Gaafa. I have actually designed and built a 'carrier current' communication system, and yes, the flashing lights would be very easy to incorporate into a system like that. There could be problems using carrier current technology with the multiple power circuits in a theatre environ, but it's worth looking into it. As my original design included (and Kathy S emphasized), it MUST include voice capability as well, because sometimes verbal communication is R E A L L Y important. This may be the first discussion board designed (of, by, and for theatre people) communication system in the world. ...Just remember, guys, I started it! HA! ;-)
	Growing old is mandatory. Growing up is optional.
	IP Logged

Gaafa Celebrity Joined: 3/21/04 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1181	Posted: 12/10/09 at 7:37pm
	Good idea! Thinking about this I have utalised a set of those cheap Infrared Baby montors, that use the powerline as an FM carrier, to great effect backstage. While this allows the bio box & SM to see in the dark, during blackouts. It would not be that much of a stretch, to incorporate a headset [mic/cans] using the other type baby monitor systems available. Most are compact units & can be used as belt packs, hitching in call & flashing light switches, as suggested. Not only but also the wireless can also be used for as show monitor relays to the dressing rooms, as they are easily concealed on the set. As far as the multi power circuit problem, we have an installing convention here. in acordance with SAA 3000 Wiring regulations, that the 3 Phase cabling installation, must be colour phase indicated at the General Purpose Outlet [GPO] & follow the code of Red, White & Blue. Undoubtably most sparkies use Red Phase for the primary utility power circuit, so it just a matter of checking the phase colour or following the electrical schemetic legend. Actualy Spectrum it would great to collectivly come up with something here on this forum, that can be utalised in most ameatre venues - Yes you can have all the kudos mate!
	Joe Western Gondawandaland turn right @ Perth. Hear the light & see the sound. Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"} May you always play to a full house}
	IP Logged

TimmyP1955 Lead Joined: 12/30/09 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 37	Posted: 1/02/10 at 1:19pm
	ClearCom has been the standard for years. However we went with Production Intercom on the recommendation of a large local production company - "they are less expensive and more reliable". http://www.beltpack.com/
	IP Logged